<article_title>Black_hole</article_title>
<edit_user>Headbomb</edit_user>
<edit_time>Wednesday, March 2, 2011 10:21:12 PM CET</edit_time>
<edit_comment>restore unspace version per [[WP:CITEVAR]]</edit_comment>
<edit_text>|last2=Bell
<strong><strike> |first2=S. J.
</strike></strong><strong> |first2=S.J.
</strong> |last3=Pilkington |first3=J. D. H.</edit_text>
<turn_user>Headbomb<turn_user>
<turn_time>Thursday, March 3, 2011 4:58:35 AM CET</turn_time>
<turn_topicname>Citation standards</turn_topicname>
<turn_topictext>This article was recently http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Black_hole&amp;action=historysubmit&amp;diff=416608002&amp;oldid=415848722 with an edit summary beginning "Spaced initials"; spaces were inserted in initials in the references, for example, "Davies, P.C.W." was changed to "Davies, P. C. W." Spacing of initials was then http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Black_hole&amp;action=historysubmit&amp;diff=416808048&amp;oldid=416744856 with an edit summary "restore unspace version per WP:CITEVAR". This is not what WP:CITEVAR is about. WP:CITEVAR says "Do not change the citation style used in an article merely for personal preference or cosmetic reasons." The issue here is "citation style." Citation style refers to a standard way of listing a citation. This article stores all of its references in templates, so Wikipedia automatically determines the citation style. Citation style is concerned with the precise order of various elements including author, journal name, page, publication date, and city; which of these elements take punctuation including periods, commas, quotation marks, colons, and parentheses; and whether authors' names are last name first or first name first. Citation style is distinct from general usage style, which is concerned with issues such as the en dash (–) for page range, and how initials are spaced. If an article were created with all of its page ranges expressed with hyphens, WP:CITEVAR does not prevent changing those hyphens to en dashes, because such a change is a matter of general usage style, not citation style. Similarly, spacing initials is a matter of general usage style, not citation style. The Wikipedia style standard is spaced initials, as can be seen by these examples: J.R.R. Tolkien redirects to J. R. R. Tolkien; George H.W. Bush redirects to George H. W. Bush; D.W. Griffith redirects to D. W. Griffith; I.M. Pei redirects to I. M. Pei. Spaced initials of human names is standard. For example, The Chicago Manual of Style 14th edition says in section 7.6 on page 237: Names and initials of persons are capitalized:...R. W. B. Lewis...The space between initials should be the same as the space between initial and name (not R. W.B. Lewis), except when initial are used alone, without periods (see 14.4). Spaces in initials is standard throughout Wikipedia and Standard English. In fact, the articles referenced in this article are published in journals that use spaced initials. For example, reference [1] is to an article in Reports on Progress in Physics, which uses spaced initials without periods; reference [13] is to an article in Physics Today, which uses spaced initials with periods; reference [15] is to an article in Physical Review, which uses spaced initials with periods; reference [17] is to an article in Nature, which uses spaced initials with periods. In sum, WP:CITEVAR says not to change established citation style within an article, but spacing of initials is an element of general usage style, not citation style, and as such, usage errors in the spacing of initials can and should be corrected. —Anomalocaris (talk) 23:53, 2 March 2011 (UTC) Spaces in initials is very much a citation styles. Names can be presented several ways. John Michael Smith / Smith, John Michael / John M. Smith / Smith, John M. / J. M. Smith / J.M. Smith / JM Smith / Smith, J. M. / Smith, J.M. / Smith, JM / Smith JM, and possibly others. font-variant:small-caps; whitespace:nowrap;Headbomb {talk / contribs / physics / books} 04:58, 3 March 2011 (UTC) Well, if you look at the bibliography in Carroll 2004 you will see that this uses unspaced initials. The same goes for 50% of the other books that are currently sitting on my desk. This disproves your assertion that spaced initials in references are a universal standard. Hence WP:CITEVAR applies. Case closed.TR 09:19, 3 March 2011 (UTC)</turn_topictext>
<turn_text>Spaces in initials is very much a citation styles. Names can be presented several ways. John Michael Smith / Smith, John Michael / John M. Smith / Smith, John M. / J. M. Smith / J.M. Smith / JM Smith / Smith, J. M. / Smith, J.M. / Smith, JM / Smith JM, and possibly others. font-variant:small-caps; whitespace:nowrap;</turn_text>