<article_title>Barry_Bonds</article_title>
<edit_user>Fizbin</edit_user>
<edit_time>Wednesday, January 20, 2010 1:12:53 AM CET</edit_time>
<edit_comment>edited for clarity</edit_comment>
<edit_text>Bonds' accomplishments during his baseball career place him among the greatest baseball players of all-time.&lt;ref&gt;&lt;/ref&gt; He has a record-setting seven Most Valuable Player awards, including a record-setting four consecutive MVPs. He is a fourteen-time All-Star and eight-time Gold Glove-winner. He holds numerous Major League Baseball records, including the all-time Major League Baseball home run record with 762 and the single-season Major League record for home runs with 73 (set in ), and is also the all-time career leader in both walks (2,558) and intentional walks (688).
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Bonds has led a controversial career, notably as a central figure in baseball's [[Banned substances in baseball|steroids scandal]]. In 2007, he was indicted for [[perjury]] and [[obstruction of justice]] concerning the government investigation of [[BALCO]], a case which is still ongoing as of January, 2010.
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Early life</edit_text>
<turn_user>Undervenued<turn_user>
<turn_time>Tuesday, January 19, 2010 6:56:17 PM CET</turn_time>
<turn_topicname>misleading intro, looks biased</turn_topicname>
<turn_topictext>Bonds admittted to using steroids, only that he didn't know they were steroids at the time. The intro conflates two different issues: number one: his using steroids which is NOT alleged but factual, with 2. allegations he LIED under oath about such usage. The lies are alleged, but his steroid usage is not. Completely NPOV. Where is the untro mention of the actual steroid use which he has mentioned?66.190.29.150 (talk) 13:30, 29 January 2009 (UTC) Entire intro has a massive pro-Bonds anti-truth bias. The man is a cheater, a liar, and a criminal. All of these are objective facts and should be mentioned. Wetman88 (talk) 17:49, 14 March 2009 (UTC) thanks for sharing your opinion. however, this is wikipedia, not wikipinion. if you have some material from WP:RS to contribute, please do. but spouting your opinions here isn't helpful. for example, bonds has not been convicted of any crime, therefore by simple logic, he is not a criminal until such time as he is. your opinion that he is so is noted. but meaningless to this article. Anastrophe (talk) 17:58, 14 March 2009 (UTC) Major premise: Taking steroids is cheating (MLB rules) Minor Premise: Barry Bonds admits to taking steroids. Conclusion: Barry Bonds is a cheater.Major premise: Saying something that isn't true is lying. Minor Premise: Barry Bonds untruthfully said that he had not taken steroids. Conclusion:Barry Bonds is a liar.Major premise: People are indicted by federal grand juries for committing crimes. Minor premise: Barry Bonds was indicted by a federal grand jury. Conclusion: Barry Bonds is a criminal. autosigned—Preceding unsigned comment added by Wetman88 (talk • contribs) 18:03, 14 March 2009 (UTC) highly recommend not pursuing a degree in law. an indictment does not make him a criminal.Anastrophe (talk) 18:34, 14 March 2009 (UTC) Barry Bonds has never admitted to knowingly taking steroids. There is no proof, other than that he got a little bigger since his early 20's. I have also gotten bigger since my early 20's, does that mean that I have taken steroids? Innocent until proven guilty, kids. Undervenued (talk) 18:51, 19 January 2010 (UTC)
Reliable sources
Cheating: "Barry Bonds:Cheater" from CBS, yea I kinda think that is reliable. http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/05/23/opinion/meyer/main2842254.shtml"Dear Barry Bonds, You are either an outright cheater or very stupid" from the USA Today http://www.usatoday.com/sports/baseball/2004-12-03-letter-bonds_x.htm"Yes, Barry Bonds is a cheater. He is a cheater of the worst sort" http://blogs.chicagotribune.com/news_columnists_ezorn/2007/08/dad-is-barry-bo.html Lying: "It's clear, Barry Bonds' a liar" New York Daily News, another pretty freakin' reliable source. http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/2008/09/24/2008-09-24_its_clear_barry_bonds_a_liar_feds.html"Barry Lamar Bonds is a bad man" Baseball Digest http://www.baseballdailydigest.com/blogs/2009/03/02/taking-a-step-back/"but Bonds is a liar, a cheater, a whiner and a bad influence on America's youth" Mark Barnes autosigned—Preceding unsigned comment added by Wetman88 (talk • contribs) 18:15, 14 March 2009 (UTC) You can't tell me that you believe everything that you read. Who are you, David St. Hubbins from Spinal Tap? Just because some horrible reporter from the New York Daily News says something, doesn't make it fact. all of which are opinion pieces. not reliable sources for claims of fact. what's your hurry? if bonds ends up being convicted of lying, cheating, etc, then it can go in the article. until then, your opinions are noted, but not admissible to this WP:BLP.Anastrophe (talk) 18:31, 14 March 2009 (UTC) Sorry I've been reading this article and a lot about baseball (actually I have some questions about wins and runs that I'd like answered, but anyway) and I can't believe that the word cheat isn't mentioned in this article once. The man is involved in a trial and it has been asserted by numerous individuals who had no reason to lie that he has taken illegal steroids to gain an unfair advantage over his peers and gone to extreme lengths to cover it up and deny it. It seems that the article is attempting to whitewash the fact that he violated the rules and turn it into something were the steroids just slowed down his ageing and kept him good. He's been publcly labelled a cheat numerous times and there is considerable controversy about it, which this article goes to great lengths to minimise. 86.8.176.85 (talk) 05:19, 21 April 2009 (UTC) He isn't involved in a trial. People always have reason to lie: personal gain. These people could be placing all of their heat onto Barry to take it away from others, or even themselves. There is no thing as a selfless act. Undervenued (talk) 18:53, 19 January 2010 (UTC)</turn_topictext>
<turn_text>You can't tell me that you believe everything that you read. Who are you, David St. Hubbins from Spinal Tap? Just because some horrible reporter from the New York Daily News says something, doesn't make it fact.</turn_text>